Liberals call this "purity testing," but fundamentally the democrats stand for perpetuating capitalism and imperialism. These two points of contention are irreconcilable with any leftist.
this post was submitted on 01 Dec 2025
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"purity testing" more like them gaslighting people into believing that they are left wing and getting defensive when they are proved not to be
Bingo.
If I'm trying to create anything worth anything you're goddamn right I'm gonna test my ingredients for purity
I agree, though I'd say there's a difference between criticism and self-criticism with what we think of as "purity testing," ie demonizing AES or other movements for their imperfections.
"Waaaah how dare you purity test me, yeah I have right wing economic views but have you considered my social views are also right wing" - average Liberal
Yep, lol
The following can all be true:
- The Democrats are a right wing neoliberal party.
- The Democrats are the most left-wing option that is realistically available to American voters.
- The Democrats can be pushed further left if American progressives work to do so.
- The Democrats - at the party level - will resist such a change, but that resistance can still be overcome.
- In the long term, massive structural overhauls and the downfall of capitalism are the only things that will save America and the world
- In the near term, voting consistly and enthusiastically for the least bad option can still protect vulnerable groups from harm and create changes that lay the groundwork for those structural overhauls.
That is their entire point. Two party system means that they can take up all space for opposition to Republicans while making their policies bipartisan.
The Democratic party is entirely built to fight any leftward movement, it isn't just that the progressives didn't try. They have been trying for 80 years. It is that the entire party is structured and designed to fight that. That is the actual reason Trump could come from the outside and completely reshape the Republicans, but the Dems can form rank and resist Bernie and the progressives.
The Democrats have shown overwhelmingly and repeatedly that they would rather lose to Republicans than move at all to the left.
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Point 3 is wrong. The working classes in the States are already increasingly left, while the DNC is increasingly rightward. The DNC doesn't care about what voters want, but what their donors need. That's why it's critical to engage with parties like PSL.
While those are technically true, they are inconseuqential at best, plain wrong at worst.
Yes, the dems could be pushed left a little over a long time in theory. But practice has shown that this is not achievable since all other material circumstances are against it.
The "least bad" option is a communist party, absolutely not the dems.
Voting is not going to help half as many people than going to the next soup kitchen or neighborhood meetup and organize there.
I hate these soc dem apology posts. Biden has blood on his hands up to his shoulders.
The funny thing about this is that if it were possible to reform the democratic party, it would only be through demanding change, and credibly threatening defection if those demands are not met. By setting conditions and giving those conditions teeth. What you're suggesting is just asking nicely for people to act directly contrary to their material interests and hoping for the best. It's complete nonsense.
Also lol at "enthusiastically voting." Yes, it's very important that you not only bend the knee to your corporate masters completely unconditionally, but that you do so with a smile on your face. You can trust me, I'm a leftist just like you, see how I say all the language about needing the downfall of capitalism?
I think we're showing mixed results on your third bullet. It did seem that way, for a while, as we pushed on social issues. And when it came time to get on with the economic issues, the core management team of the party rallied, and rather than adopt the left flank to win, steps right to hand control to Republicans.
And it's happened more than once now, to obvious and clear effect: the goal of the Democratic party isn't to win elections, it's to keep the country idealogically aligned with a neoliberal ruling class. And if that means handing control of government to Republicans, they'll do so, then blame the left (even though it's them moving to the right losing elections).
To the fourth bullet, no, it's not clear that within the machinations of the party infrastructure it can be overcome. Because if not now, when? Party leadership has never been weaker or more vulnerable nor the times more desperate. Democrats as a party poll worse than Trump, yet progressives can win elections with both the entire Republican and Democratic apparatus gunning to take them down. yet somehow we can't replace Schumer's or Jefferies.
Skipping to the 6th point, again, that isn't actually borne out by the evidence. It's not something well know in advance and only as an artifact of history. What's been extremely clearly is that so far, voting has been wildly insufficient to make the kinds of structural changes necessary. Obama is the classic example of this. He runs on healthcare, holding wallstreet accountable, and ending the wars; he delivers corporate "access", bails out the banks, and continues the wars. The voters did their job and the system didn't work.
So a relentless optimism that the system will just work as intended doesn't seem warranted, and it's clearly not going in a good direction.
Until we recognize that the Democratic party, it at least it's current and historical structure is at the core of the problem with why we can't advance political change, its pretty clear that this decent into autocracy, fascism, and a degraded quality of life is inevitable. The Democratic party isn't just part of the problem: it's the core element of the problem.
You could’ve made this image using paint in under 5 minutes, did you really need to waste half a liter of water to have AI generate it?
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The wing doesn't matter if the eagle is a nazi tbf.
Their strategy is to give into Trump's demands in the hopes that it prevents him from destroying their precious institutions. They hope to be able to take over from an unpopular Republican party after Trump dies without really undoing the damage he's done. The problem with this approach is that it will prevent the system from needing to be properly rebuilt, effectively legalizing most of his abuses of power and prolonging the instability of our country. A big part of this will be institutionalizing the blatant corruption and oligarchy while further rigging elections to make it impossible for popular movements to ever legally gain power.
A Gavin Newsom or Pete Buttigieg presidency will see them ruling as a weaker feudal king than Trump, but only to promote business activity and interests. Relying on the honeymoon period following Trump's removal, they will position themselves as the saviors of "democracy," yet they will do little to actually undo a lot of the election rigging that Republicans are installing right now. They will suppress workers rights and throw the most disposable minorities under the bus, deregulating and burning through all the goodwill they have. They'll parade the corpse of liberalism around as long as fools will believe it, but it will be a cynical gesture.
In order for actual liberal democracy to exist again in this country, the liberals would need to have shown a backbone and resist Trump no matter how much he destroys institutions. They would need to risk temporary jail time and potential assassination to invigorate long term support for a rebuilt American dream. Instead they're showing that they never cared about liberal ideals, only the goodwill liberalism afforded their power.
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All I want is the freedom to vote how I want and still count my vote if my first choice didn't win. Democrats should be free to run their political party how they want. Just like how everyone else should be free to participate in our elections. Free of a spoiler effect.
There should be no monopoly on the future of our nation. Republican, or Democrat.
Surely the freedom to vote how people want is not to high a bar for the democrats to clear right? Self proclaimed democracy advocates surely want the people to be represented fully... right?
I would never force a liberal to vote for my preference in a election, why is it okay for them to do that to me?
And it is a conscious decision to force me to vote a certain way. Every election democrats mercilessly rage at 3rd party voters. The Democratic party and their voters understand that First-past-the-post voting is flawed. Yet in blue states, fully in control of the Democratic party, FPTP voting shackles the people.
Democrats understand FPTP voting does a bad job of representing the nation. They ignore this festering gaping mortal wound... all for safe states and easy elections against a complete clown show. One that has defeated them in every way possible.
The monopoly is over democrats. You never deserved it, and you most certainly do not deserve it now in our darkest hours. Get out of the way, we have to move forward as a nation.
The Democratic party is not more important then the United States of America.
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I don't think chsnging the voting system will fix this. There is still a 2 party system in australia despite a democracy with preferential voting for over 100 years.
Bingo. Class dynamics take priority over voting mechanisms.
The system can’t be reformed to favor the working class because it was created by & for the owner class, the “donor” class. If necessary they will unleash fascism to maintain control.
The Democratic party is not more important then the United States of America.
They both have to go. There’s never going to be a socialist USA. That can only happen after a revolution leading to an different state with a different name.
I think actually a party guilty of genocide should not be free to run in elections, or even free to remain outside of prison
Nothing new, in a profoundly capitalist structure like the US, there are no other options than to choose between conservatism and fascism, substituting reason for "in God we trust" and "Stars and Stripes", to keep citizens ignorant and obedient to continue functioning.
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