this post was submitted on 06 Apr 2025
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BuyFromEU

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A post from /r/BuyFromEU got my blood boiling. I don't have an account there any longer, so I have to vent here:

Personally, I am not buying into this idea that you should support a certain business just because it is based in your vicinity. I will buy the product that comes at the best price for the quality I desire. If it is Japanese or American or Chinese, so be it.

In my opinion, the BuyFromEU movement will fail unless the governments of EU countries make a serious attempt to understand the reasons why businesses struggle in the EU and address the structural issues preventing them from scaling up.

Essentially, it is the government's job to fix the reasons why people weren't buying from EU in the first place. Unless the government cuts down on regulations, unless they makes it easier for people to grow their wealth by working hard and not having to pay 50% of their paycheck in taxes, unless they make electricity and gas cheaper, unless they fix the housing shortages in all major cities of Western Europe - this movement will FAIL. Buying Paturain instead of Philadelphia cream cheese is never going to help your economy grow strong.

My choice to not buy Nike and buy Adidas instead will only help the top bosses at Adidas. I am going to still be taxed at 50% of my income, so I might as well buy the cheapest product. The government should give me a serious incentive to buy European, then I will.

The Reddit OP shows a perfect example of:

  • Deflecting towards the government instead of taking personal responsibility
  • Complaining about taxes and greedy cooperation, while only looking for a personal financial benefit

We as as Europeans must be willing to be uncomfortable again. We ARE the system. So to change the system, we are the ones that must change. Stop whining, start winning.

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[–] the_wiz@feddit.org 42 points 1 day ago (3 children)

I think we are now finally at a point where the individual choices either make you a part of the solution... or of the problem. A neutral, "I don't care" stance puts a person in the later of the two categories.

[–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 3 points 16 hours ago

thats been the case for a while now

[–] alexcleac@szmer.info 7 points 1 day ago

I’d say we are already far past the point. It’s just that that most people haven’t noticed it yet, and it is that late for that.

[–] guest@feddit.org 5 points 1 day ago

That's a great way to put it. Thanks for sharing.

[–] Pirata@lemm.ee 21 points 1 day ago

This is 100% AstroTurfing. Report+block and never feed the trolls.

Our movement is causing a real impact which is why these people are showing up. Be smart and hold the line.

[–] Parptarf@lemm.ee 22 points 1 day ago (1 children)

There are some reasonable and rational criticisms in that statement. But that doesn’t take away the fact that individuals actually do have power if they’re working together. I’m not for a full and complete boycott. But I am 100% for trying to use European alternatives where it’s actually feasible. Like using as little of Googles ecosystem as possible. Or supporting local groceries and products.

My money. My choice.

[–] locast@lemmy.world 12 points 1 day ago

He is a pure consumer and that all he has ever known all his life. I can’t blame him for being him and him from being the fruit that our system bears. This is why this moment is a positive endeavor if done correctly. We, as Europeans, need more sense of community. We need to think more about the persons living next to us, find ways how we can all boost ourselves together. This is not only about products and consumerism, this is about us as a collective gaining conscience about how we can move further as a true union. This is what this person fails to see, but they will see it, given time.

[–] miramatz@feddit.org 21 points 1 day ago

I think what a lot of people don't realize is that they often don't use the best products or services for them. They simply use what everyone else uses, or what they believe is best for them. I recently changed my operating system, video editing software, cloud service provider, e-mail provider, ... For me, the switch was difficult, but as a result I believe I'm now more happy with the services I use. Think of WhatsApp, I'm not using it because it's actually better than other messaging apps, it's way worse, but since everyone else uses it, I don't really have a choice but to use it.

I wholeheartedly believe that for 95% of the population, switching products and services to local providers can improve not just their experience with said products, but also save them money. It's obviously not true for everything, but if the movement focuses on the actual improvements that local services can provide, rather then sacrificing something "better" just for something local, more people could be convinced to take the initial step to change something.

[–] Zachariah@lemmy.world 14 points 1 day ago

seems like astroturfing

[–] SrMono@feddit.org 16 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Sure he isn’t an american trolling?

[–] p_kanarinac@retrolemmy.com 19 points 1 day ago (1 children)

The "50% tax" makes me think it is.

[–] Vlado@feddit.org 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (2 children)

Honest question, why? I’m not saying the guy doesn’t sound like an astroturfing attempt, but not because of those 50%. When I look at my payslip, I see that the money I get is 50% of the money I cost my employer. And that doesn’t include VAT I pay on everything.

[–] MSBBritain@lemmy.world 2 points 22 hours ago (1 children)

But it also doesn't include the benefits you gain from those taxes.

There's your net income, and your disposable income at the end, after you paid for insurance, food, medicine, and all the other things you need to survive. Looking at the net income instead of the disposable one makes the US seem, very clearly, much better off.

However, as soon as you start looking into disposable income and a true, "net net" of how much money I can save and spend on god knows what, the US starts falling behind FAST.

As a result, most US Americans tend to cope using that nice big number and conveniently forget the real number at the end.

But do keep in mind this is general and doesn't always hold true. As much as I may dislike the US right now, the US really is more like 50 tiny countries than one big one, so results vary depending on where you look. Especially along the Democrat-Republican divide.

[–] Vlado@feddit.org 1 points 21 hours ago

I am pretty aware of what those taxes pay for. But it doesn’t change the fact that they do exist and they are high. Regardless - in my country, lots of people are always complaining about high taxes, so whenever I see someone mentioning them, it doesn’t imply that they’re American.

[–] p_kanarinac@retrolemmy.com 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Because whenever someone pulls out a number like that, it's always an American. I've even had some of them try to convince me it adds up to cca 50% like I don't know my brutto. And there's this "EU is a country" attitude to it.

[–] Ideonek@lemm.ee 11 points 1 day ago (1 children)

One part of the problem, that he's completely missing is that those are are not fairly competing free market prices. Many of those hegemons like Google gain their positions using what basicly is dumping pricess. They are loosing moment or Gmail, Maps, Drive, Gemini (AI), and many more "free or cheep". Competitors are buried, bought on, copied, or starved as they need to.compeat with someone who is willing to burn millions. So many services that are leaders in their fields didn't deliver a single dollar of profit yet. Their literal business plan is "we will take it all back once no one will have a choice anymore"

"Just find a way to compete" is basicly victim blaming at this point.

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 1 points 17 hours ago (1 children)

@Ideonek @guest I don't think thats the main issue. Europeans (governments, companies and people alike) are prone to make themselves less / smaller than they really are in a #calimerosyndrome We are not 'show-offy' enough apparently.

#kSuitePro is cheaper than #MS365 or #Workspace
#magicearth works better than #maps for navigation (less distraction)
#LibreOffice and #Linux just work for 95% of users if they have the will

#nobigtech #unplugtrump #sovereignty

[–] Ideonek@lemm.ee 1 points 16 hours ago (3 children)

Don't know much about magicearth,

But workspace have, so much more features than kSuitPro, that this is not even a fiar comparison. Even if you dont count externalities like Gemini, Video, notebookLM...

The convenience of Google Photos is unmatched, buy any corresponding services.

Mistrel AI is a Clippy compared to ChatGPT and Gemini Advenced. Those companies are burning money on every query, but - until they kill everything else - they are generating tremendous value to the users. Idea that Minsterl would be just as popular if only it promote itself without false modesty is hard to defend.

LibraOffice is free, but google sheet is as well, and cloud-ready on top of that.

Linux... sure, but for the same people free chromeOS is just as good if not better becouse more convinient. With google anything is in cloud anyway, right? Sure, Linux is amazing. But it's not exactly out-of-the-box. And if we count android... And who knows what Fussia will bring?

If you don't want to pay, Google offer is more convinient. If you do want to pay, it's broader and more powerful, all things equal.

Don't get me wrong. It's a trade of worth making. But pretending it's easy and that there are no costs is misleading people. I'm doing it. I'm committed. So far I paying twice as much as I did pay for my tech-stack, and there are still gaps that I lost in the process.

But it won't change, and only be worse if we are not ready to be uncomfortable for a while. It's a diet. If we oversell how easy it is, people will try and go back to junk food in a minute.

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 0 points 8 hours ago* (last edited 8 hours ago) (1 children)

@Ideonek And Mistral (which is also built into #kSuite alongside with sovereign #Llama) isn't exactly Clippy. Come on...

It sure isn't perfect / not as good as ChatGPT right now but #LLMs need to LEARN and #Mistral cannot learn if we don't use it.

Also: a large part of the superiority of #ChatGPT stems from the fact that they scrape copyrighted sources that they actually have no permission to use. Do you want to support that? I sure as heck don't.

[–] Ideonek@lemm.ee 1 points 8 hours ago* (last edited 8 hours ago)

Immortaly gained superiority is exactly my initial point.

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 0 points 8 hours ago (1 children)

@Ideonek Everything you NEED is there, I can assure you. And then some. But if you keep looking for excuses to not make the change, you'll never do it.

Sure it is uncomfortable. Sure it takes getting used to. I still don't know everything I probably should about Linux and FOSS. But in the end it brings peace of mind.

Not worrying who looks over your shoulder. Your data is yours. And it works...

[–] Ideonek@lemm.ee 2 points 8 hours ago

I agree on all points, except on you deciding what I need. I would prefer to be the one making that call.

One could argue that pen and paper is all you need. And it would be just as productive.

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 0 points 8 hours ago* (last edited 8 hours ago) (1 children)

@Ideonek Either you WANT to support European / private solutions or you don't. It IS that easy. It's need vs want

I've been a Workspace and MS365 user and Admin for years.

And you are throwing the free and business tiers together like it's the same. It's not.

Free? It ain't free. US companies make you pay with your #data and #privacy. That should be worth SOMETHING to you. It is to them. Millions.

#Linux not out of the box? Is #Windows? How long did it take you to learn that? #nobigtech

[–] Ideonek@lemm.ee 1 points 8 hours ago

I honestly think that approach like this is hurting the movement. You're dismissive about experience of someone who deleted Microsoft account and canceled most US-based serviced and social media that he was most engaged with. And you're literally explaining to me how convinient it is to me?

This revolution is way to small, to start eating their own already.

[–] stardust@lemmy.ca 15 points 1 day ago

Troll bot trying to discourage people.

[–] BlaueHeiligenBlume@feddit.org 13 points 1 day ago

Troll or russian bot ...

[–] alexcleac@szmer.info 6 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I think there is quite a bit of rational thought in the statements. Though, it is definitely clear the person was either emotional, or was trying to make you emotional (and apparently succeeded) :)

I 100% think that without support of government, such boycott or switch in choice priorities might be having some risks, especially in high-tech markets, where Europe is obviously behind. Though, the statement about taxes clearly incorrect, because decreasing taxes would straight lower ability of EMEA area to actually make the investment at all, especially in circumstances, when countries have to put huge fractions of their GDP into militarization on extremely short notice and with deadline set to “three years ago”.

Taking that into account, I think that was just a troll account, or not too intelligent person being fed a pile of disinformation. Regardless of what it is: it is the wisest to ignore opinions of such people, they are simply not worth the wasted energy :)

[–] guest@feddit.org 2 points 1 day ago

Yeah indeed, if that was a troll he totally got me :)

[–] p_kanarinac@retrolemmy.com 5 points 1 day ago

This post is very ignorant, especially "people aren't buying from EU" - most people are and most people do try to buy local, at least that's what I see. The only exceptions are tech and some junk food. But daily stuff, fashion, furniture etc - local or EU.

[–] huppakee@lemm.ee 2 points 1 day ago

There is this saying if you aren't part of the solution, you're part of the problem. This is maybe a bit of a narrow view, but here's my two cent: people can say whatever they want, it matters what they do. If this person chooses to do nothing, fine. If this person goes online and try to persuade others from doing nothing than he's part of the problem. Totally understand you want to vent here. Hope he this guy gets some headwind on Reddit.

[–] Sunshine@lemmy.ca 1 points 1 day ago

Screw that defeatist poster.