this post was submitted on 19 Mar 2025
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Here's an exercise in extreme masochism: (lemmy.world)
submitted 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) by semperverus@lemmy.world to c/linux@lemmy.ml
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The Linux Ship of Theseus

  1. pick any distro and install it.

  2. Then, without installing another distro over the top of it, slowly convert it into another distro by replacing package managers, installed packages, and configurations.

System must be usable and fully native to the new distro (all old packages replaced with new ones).

No flatpaks, avoid snaps where physically possible, native packages only.

EDIT: Some clarification on some of the clever tools brought up here:

chroot, dd, debootstrap, and partition editors that allow you to install the new system in an empty container or blanket-overwrite the old system go against the spirit of this challenge.

These are very useful and valid tools under a normal context and I strongly recommend learning them.

You can use them if you prefer, but The ship of Theseus was replaced one board at a time. We are trying to avoid dropping a new ship in the harbor and tugging the old one out.

It may however be a good idea to use them to test out the target system in a safe environment as you perform the migration back in the real root, so you have a reference to go by.

Easy: pick two similar distros, such as Ubuntu and Debian or Manjaro and Arch and go from the base to the derivative.

Medium: Same as easy but go from the derivative to the base.

Hard: Pick two disparate distros like Debian and Artix and go from one to the other.

Nightmare: Make a self-compiled distro your target.

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[–] sxan@midwest.social 4 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

I've done the Arch to Artix. It wasn't hard, per se, but it took a while. I think that should be Medium, because Artix isn't just an Arch derivative.

In fact, might I suggest a different way of looking at the difficulties?

  • Replacing the package manager: Hard.
  • Replacing the package manager without a live USB: Extreme.
  • Going from a basic systemd-based distro (init, log, cron) to anything else: Hard
  • Going from a systemd distro that's bought into the entire systemd stack, including home and boot: Extreme
  • Going from one init to another: Medium
  • Changing boot systems: grub to UEFI, for example: Easy.
  • Replacing all GNU tools with other things: Extreme (mainly because of script expectations).

And so on. You get 1 point for Easy, 2 for Medium, 4 for Hard, and 8 for Extreme. Add 'em up, go for a high score.

I don't think rolling your own is that hard, TBH, unless you're expected to also build a package manager. If maintaining it would be harder than building it.

[–] semperverus@lemmy.world 2 points 2 weeks ago

I like it

[–] OsrsNeedsF2P@lemmy.ml 3 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

I would watch a YouTube series doing this

[–] tourist@lemmy.world 3 points 2 weeks ago

whoever runs the channel will singlehandedly cause a worldwide antidepressant shortage

[–] merthyr1831@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 weeks ago

Not quite the same but you might like the Linux from Nothing series, building out a Linux install from first principles.

Obviously lots of linux youtubers have done videos on linux from scratch too but the step by step nature is pretty enjoyable to watch.

[–] mariusafa@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 2 weeks ago

Okay i'll cheat with Guix then

[–] ArsonButCute@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 2 weeks ago

I've got a blank macbook air at home waiting for a project.

I've never undergone a project like this without cheating by using bedrock linux as an intermediary then "Unbedrocking" my install (officially impossible, unofficially insane) with another PM as my default to convert from debian to arch years ago.

This is gonna be fun, or hellish, idk I'll find out.

[–] arality@programming.dev 1 points 2 weeks ago

May, I introduce you to bedrock

[–] NicolaHaskell@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 weeks ago

without installing another distro over the top of it ... [replace] package managers

The package manager is the distro, though.

$ pacman -S apk-tools
$ apk add alpine-base linux-lts

Then kexec to alpine's kernel and the initramfs generated by its installation (which would incidentally "replace" PID 1 with the new /sbin/init). For clean up you could take a diff of "tar -t" for all the installed packages from both distros then delete the files only in the old distro's packages.

Make a self-compiled distro your target.

Replace the first step with a compilation of apk, abuild everything required by alpine-base and linux-lts (git clone aports to bootstrap that work), then add the package directory to /etc/apk/repositories before the second step. Next, begin to worry that you haven't fully broken free yet, replace abuild with a bespoke mybuild and apk with tar -x, grapple with signed binaries, reflect on your own identity and authenticity, then take a tour through gentoo and find yourself missing the $HOME you left and its familiar comforts.

[–] GoOnASteamTrain@lemmy.ml 0 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

I "broke" linux mint just by trying to pop KDE on, had to timeshift because it messed up my keyboard layout and a whole bunch of other things with my display.

I don't know how people do these crazy changes without pain, and have a feeling the answer is simply "there's pain" 😂

[–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

theres pain but its also very satisfying to pull this kind of stuff off. im more of a stable system kind of guy these days tho.

[–] Fizz@lemmy.nz 0 points 2 weeks ago

Easymode: pick a fedora ublue distro and go from bazzite to silver blue :)

TitleYou can rebase with a single command I think.