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[–] 54 points 1 year ago (16 children)

Yeah, I don’t know how to solve the issues of two separate families feeling ownership for the same location (fifty years ago, a Palestinian family including several living members was evicted from a home, and an Israeli couple moved in and then died, leaving their property to their children who played no role in taking the property from the Palestinians), but the solution is not to deport all of the Israelis from the region.

My first instinct would be that the government would need to build a LOT of desirable housing and offer a cash incentive to all current and former residents to cede ownership claims to other properties in exchange for the deed to one of the newer properties, but it immediately occurs to me that the wealth difference between the average Palestinian family and the average Israeli family is probably large enough that there would essentially be a self-selection bias. Especially given the fact that poverty and food insecurity reduce our ability to make good financial decisions.

I can’t think of a resolution for that situation that doesn’t involve someone feeling resentful. I’m not saying they have equal claim- but I know that the descendants of settlers are also people, who don’t want to be evicted from the (stolen) houses in which they were raised, and sowing resentment has not helped the region in the past.

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  • [–] [S] 24 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    I mean, eminent domain exists for this reason, but generally, compensation for stolen property is the norm because of the difficulty of dealing with inheritances and the like several steps removed from the original crime.

    Recognizing the validity of residency is not the same as recognizing privilege. "You can stay under the same criteria as anyone else, because we aren't here to engage in ethnic cleansing" and "Your property is sacrosanct and cannot be touched under any circumstances" are two different concepts, after all.

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  • [–] 13 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    Oh, there are a thousand ways they could improve their current way of handling it. I just don’t know what the best way would be, though it would definitely involve eminent domain. I guess a lottery system for determining which families get the ancestral home?

    I used to take solace in the fact that people smarter than I were in charge of this, so they could do better than that as a solution, but I’m increasingly skeptical that they actually will.

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  • [–] [S] 19 points 1 year ago

    One of the most horrific things to learn in life is that not only are people in power often shitheads, they're often stupid shitheads as well.

    It's... frustrating when examining policy discussions on an academic level.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago* (9 children)

    By this logic Germans would not have had to give back the property that the Nazis robbed from the Jews. This is complete nonsense.

    You cannot inherit legally, what was robbed from someone else. The legal ownership belongs to the original owners or their inheritors.

    Any Israeli living in a house or on land they robbed, must either leave or buy it from the legitimate owners at a fair price. Irrespective of that the legitimate owners must also be fully compensated for the inability to use their land for all the years it was kept from them.

    This is the legal and just way. Any other way invites more crimes and crimes against humanity as it rewards the criminals including by rewarding their descendants.

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    [–] 37 points 1 year ago (21 children)

    We've tried a 1 state solution for a long time

    It's probably time to start aknowledging the goal of Zionism is to take land from others, and aknowledge that the Zionist have too much influence in politics.

    It's either the Zionists go, or we just have to accept that Isreal wants to behave like a fascist colonizer and cut ties

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    [–] 36 points 1 year ago (34 children)

    Israel is allowed to literally cause a holocaust on the Palestinian people for the last 70+ years, backed by seemingly the majority of the political landscape and the population. Israelis chanting death to entire ethnicities but nooooo we can't say anything that might hurt their poor lil feelings. Bunch of bollocks. You lot are a bunch of clowns that are entirely too comfortable with the deaths of brown people.

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    [–] 24 points 1 year ago (16 children)

    The meme itself is fine.

    But shilling a one-state solution with it?

    Not cool.

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    [–] 22 points 1 year ago (15 children)

    Any criticism of the Israeli government, no matter how milquetoast, gets called anti-semitic by defenders, folks shouldn't be shocked when people shrug after a while, say, "guess I'm anti-semitic now", and really let loose.

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  • [–] [S] 28 points 1 year ago (11 children)

    Any criticism of the Israeli government, no matter how milquetoast, gets called anti-semitic by defenders, folks shouldn’t be shocked when people shrug after a while, say, “guess I’m anti-semitic now”, and really let loose.

    Uh, except for the bit where 'letting loose' is 'revealing that they actually are antisemitic'. I generally assume that people, and especially left-leaning people, aren't antisemitic even if Israel critiques them as such; to find out that a very nonzero amount actually are, and a much larger amount are willing to endorse or tolerate those antisemitic views, is deeply disturbing.

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    [–] 22 points 1 year ago (10 children)

    Thanks to Netanyahu and his goonies (such as Trump and Starmer) the word anti-semitist has lost all meaning.

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    [–] 20 points 1 year ago (9 children)

    I hold equal disdain for all Abrahamic Religions.

    They are a plague.

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    [–] 19 points 1 year ago (12 children)

    Jewish people and groups around the world need to issue strong rejection of Israel's actions.

    If they don't, i'm very concerned that Israel's crimes will fall back on them in the future.

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    [–] 18 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    Albert Einstein is 100% correct. Read his letter to the NY Times.

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    [+] 15 points 1 year ago (3 children)
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    [–] 15 points 1 year ago* (15 children)

    I really don't understand people who think a one state solution is possible anymore. I'm not sure if it ever was but certainly at this point it's not viable.

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  • [–] 16 points 1 year ago* (2 children)

    Nothing is "viable" if you just extrapolate the present, except I guess genocide.

    To take a step back, moral ambition and political courage are necessary. If Ireland could reach a Good Friday Agreement, if South Africa could overcome apartheid, so can Palestine/Israel.

    A plurinational democratic state with equal rights for all, with a truth and reconciliation process, and with strong international support is the only way the middle east can ever reach peace.

    And if we are putting on big boy pants and imagining a better world, why not envision the Mediterranean Union becoming a force for democratization and stabilization allowing the free movement of people throughout the region.

    When realism is dystopian, fuck realism and pick utopia. Otherwise, why even live?

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    [–] 13 points 1 year ago (10 children)

    As long as:

    Stolen land is given back, and criminals prosecuted,

    Sure.

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    [–] 13 points 1 year ago

    Israel is the most anti-Jewish state since Nazi Germany, and Palestinians are semitic.

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  • [–] 12 points 1 year ago (9 children)

    So many people on the left for whom jew = Zionist = fascist Israeli. It plays right in the hand of all the actual right-wingers and fascists supporting Israel. Appalling and stupid.

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    [–] 10 points 1 year ago (2 children)

    I get the sentiment and I'd agree, but it would be so much easier if not over half the Israeli population is now supporting a genocide. You think they know better, of all people

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    [–] 9 points 1 year ago (1 child)

    But do the Israelis WANT to integrate though ?

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    [–] 9 points 1 year ago* (1 child)
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    [–] 9 points 1 year ago

    Oh we out here making friends in these comment sections today.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago

    Fuck Israel, genocidal scum!

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (19 children)

    I have never, ever heard of someone calling for the deportation of Israelis. I think anyone who wants that was probably anti-semitic already and has taken the objectively horrific actions of the IDF as a reason to hate Jewish people in general.

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    [–] 8 points 1 year ago

    Shit can I get expelled back to Britain? They got their own problems but fuck, my family is in the domesday book, can I go back?

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  • [–] 8 points 1 year ago (9 children)

    If it's antisemitic to call out and despise those that support the genocide of innocent children and civilians, then I'm a proud antisemite. That hill I WILL die on.

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  • [–] [S] 10 points 1 year ago (3 children)

    No, that's not antisemitic in the least. Israel is committing a genocide, and it should be treated as a pariah state and all measures possible employed against it to pressure it to cease.

    What is antisemitic is, as mentioned in the title and seen advocated by people in this very comment section, advocating for the ethnic cleansing and genocide of Israel, especially when combined with the bizarre notion that Israel-born Israelis can just be shipped back to where their ancestors came from in Europe, like some bizarre mirror image of the Nazis in the 1930s planning to ethnically cleanse Germany of Jews by shipping them to where their ancestors came from in Palestine.

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