top 50 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] 66 points 1 month ago (59 children)

That privacy was already long gone by the time of this case.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2232

(a)Destruction or Removal of Property To Prevent Seizure.—
Whoever, before, during, or after any search for or seizure of property by any person authorized to make such search or seizure, knowingly destroys, damages, wastes, disposes of, transfers, or otherwise takes any action, or knowingly attempts to destroy, damage, waste, dispose of, transfer, or otherwise take any action, for the purpose of preventing or impairing the Government’s lawful authority to take such property into its custody or control or to continue holding such property under its lawful custody and control, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 5 years, or both.

If he hadn't used duress and had just refused, he'd have been fine. Graphine is secure and would have had his back

If he hadn't given them the code and instead left it in his wallet, and they did it themselves, he'd have been fine.

All he had to do was plead the 5th.

He's going to get hit with a felony for destroying data to prevent a search. There are tons of precedents in the 11th Circuit for searching without a warrant.

A duress password is only useful if what you'd be facing is worse than 18 U.S. Code § 2232a, and then only if they don't have enough to convict you already.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2rokxux5cU`___`

Dude is just protesting the construction of a large cop training facility near him. I don't know what the fuck he did to get on the FBI radar, but I wish him good luck; he's gonna need it.

  • source
  • hideshow 59 child comments
  • [–] 19 points 1 month ago (3 children)

    I don't think ordinary citizens should be required to know the law in lawyer-like detail when they travel.

    I think in the broad strokes, you're probably right about his legal situation, but it suuuuuucks and it's not what I think of when I hear the word "freedom," for sure.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • load more comments (1 reply)
  • [–] 10 points 1 month ago (2 children)

    The issue I'm seeing with the whole case is they siezed his phone, they kept his phone, the seizure of his property happened successfully. A person later entered something they believed would open it but instead it wiped it. The end user didn't wipe it, and didn't lie to the agents of the state because a duress PIN is still a PIN, I'm willing to wager they didn't specify that they wanted his 'unlock PIN' and instead just asked him for a PIN (personal identification number), which he gave.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • load more comments (39 replies)
    [–] 64 points 1 month ago (18 children)

    Advice: if you know you don´t want your phone searched going through customs, don't bring it! Or wipe it before you go through. I'm 100% on this guy's side, but we're not exactly living in a free and open society.

  • source
  • hideshow 18 child comments
  • [–] 46 points 1 month ago (5 children)

    This isn't new. Journalists coming into the US in the aughts would be harassed by CBT and DHS, forced to open and unlock their laptops (and then delete whatever the officers found unsavory.

    So they'd come in with their computers fully encrypted and wouldn't have the pass key, themselves, so it was impossible to unlock them. If they were detained unreasonably, that became a new story the next morning.

    Once through customs, correspondents would call their office and get the key.

    But it sucks if you don't have a whole news agency to back your rights.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 5 child comments
  • [–] 8 points 1 month ago (4 children)

    Interesting. Could they hold the device, though, until it's unlocked? I think this might be the Bad Press exception, not a legal right that would work for anyone else. Because if I gave the encryption key to a friend, they would just tell me to call the friend and get it.... and if they refused to give it to me, it would because I instructed them not to...

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 10 points 1 month ago (3 children)

    No, they would just refuse you entry to the country.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 14 points 1 month ago (2 children)

    Yes, if you're not a citizen they can do that. If you are a citizen, they can not deny you entry.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
  • [–] 17 points 1 month ago (9 children)

    Seriously. Wipe it, claim it's new to you or whatever, put your stuff back on later if you need to. I'm sure you can find somewhere or someone you trust to get you that data back whenever you actually need it.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 9 child comments
  • [–] 23 points 1 month ago (8 children)

    It brings up an interesting question: if wiping your phone after being requested access to it is illegal (?), would wiping your phone in anticipation of access being requested also illegal? Are we effectively required to give the federal government access to every private account in order to travel?

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 8 child comments
  • [–] 8 points 1 month ago (5 children)

    My understanding is that if you knew a search was going to happen, it’s illegal. But good luck proving that you knew it would happen.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 5 child comments
  • load more comments (2 replies)
  • load more comments (2 replies)
    [–] 60 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (16 children)

    You know, since we are entering into a lot of legal weirdness here, how about this:

    You give the cops TWO passwords. You tell them one is the duress password, and the other is the password that will unlock the phone.

    Desperate and without a warrant, they try one. Wrong try! Phone is wiped.

    In reality, both are duress passwords but they would have to prove that. (GoS only currently supports one duress password)

    Yes, it's ridiculous, but everything about this is ridiculous.

  • source
  • hideshow 16 child comments
  • [–] 73 points 1 month ago (11 children)

    Nah, write the duress password on a piece of paper and keep it in your phone case. Then keep your mouth shut. Let the cops find it and try it themselves.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 11 child comments
  • [–] 20 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    Yes! Or even better, make it 1234 or your birthdate and let them guess it on their own.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • load more comments (2 replies)
  • [–] 30 points 1 month ago (3 children)

    And what about maybe also adding in a friend or relative that's with you so that you can inform the cop that one of you tells only truths and one of you tells only lies. I think we're onto something here. 'Dispatch, I'm gonna need the Riddlemaster to come down here. We got another one.'

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 58 points 1 month ago

    It pretty much makes privacy illegal.

  • source
  • [–] 42 points 1 month ago (4 children)

    I think what he did was brave and I think there's a good chance he loses this, and I think the guilty verdict will be really unpopular

  • source
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 20 points 1 month ago (3 children)

    There's an easy legal loophole.

    When you seize their phone, tell them your passcode is explicitly not the destruction code, and do not answer any more questions besides insisting this.

    When they inevitability try to put in the only thing you mentioned, its entirely their fault for the erase.

    Your milage may vary depending on financial class.

  • source
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • [–] 6 points 1 month ago (4 children)

    What if you don't wipe it, but a different password sends the user to a virtual instance with unremarkable accounts.

  • source
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • load more comments (4 replies)
    [–] 5 points 1 month ago (8 children)

    What if we just say I always forget the code and use the built-in too many tries wipes the data setting?

    If you forgot the code can you offer to let them have it? Then you could wipe it remotely?

    Trying to understand what would happen if you really forgot the passcode.

  • source
  • hideshow 8 child comments
  • [–] 5 points 1 month ago (5 children)

    Unless you suffered some traumatic brain injury, nobody is going to believe you can't unlock your phone after being in detention for 24 hours.

    It would probably be treated as an intentional wipe.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 5 child comments
  • load more comments (2 replies)
  • load more comments (1 reply)
    load more comments
    view more: next ›