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[–] -3 points 2 days ago (3 children)

U.K. criminal justice system continuing its decline into facism I see. Remind me, if the government doesn't like your speech is that a crime eligible for a juryless trial?

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  • [–] 1 point 3 days ago (32 children)

    It sounds like this issue is the anti migrant groups and not the flag raising itself

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  • [–] 23 points 2 days ago (7 children)

    Except the flags are poorly put up pieces of shitty polyester.

    We all know which country we're in, we don't need violence and plastic waste littering the streets to remind us.

    It's not patriotism, it's brain dead virtue signaling. Patriotism would involve improving the lives of people in this country, this achieves nothing but make the place worse.

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  • [–] 1 point 6 hours ago*

    Totally agree. “The problem is not the left wing, Labour Party or Andy Burnham and it is not politics or immigration at all. It is people. Brits have become thuggish, violent, selfish, backward idiots swayed by an ultra-right-wing press and crass, insidious social media and ultra right-wing thugs such as Stephen Yaxley-Lennon, better known as Tommy Robinson. The toxic growth of the neoliberal Farage and Reform are also distorting the political life and views of the electorate, a substantial number now falling for this odious world view. You know how the American Idiot is a legendary figure around the world? Welcome to the British Buffoon. He is a figure that does not care about anything, will accept any level of indignity, any collapse in living standards if he gets to wave the Union Jack, shake a fist at the world, and sing Britannia Uber Alles. Maybe he is a fisherman, who voted for Brexit, now does not have any fish to catch, and instead of understanding that he was lied to, that Europe was just a convenient scapegoat, he still votes ultra conservative or the disgustingly xenophobic and vile racist Reform. Maybe he is a farmer, who is now facing bankruptcy, since exports to Europe basically do not exist anymore in many farming sectors and yet he still votes ultra conservative or the odious Farage’s Reform because he has been taught that xenophobia is worth more than having a living. Maybe she is a working-class single mom, raising a family in public housing voting against public housing and income because she has been taught that billionaires such as Farage will fix everything. Or maybe she is a middle-class professional whose savings have been drained after more than a decade of austerity, now paying for college, healthcare, childcare, but still votes conservative or Reform because she has been taught that being “woke” is a threat to her kind, culture, identity, and place in the world. What happens when people fail at democracy like this? Well, it is simple. Democracy fails. A society becomes a failed state. Not in the way we are used to thinking of it. There is a coup, there is a revolution, the army rolls in, the government collapses. But in a softer, altogether more dangerous way. Consensually. A country commits suicide as a modern, functioning society not with a bang, but with a million whimpers, shrieks of rage, howls of xenophobia, racism, guttural snarls of nationalism and inane flag waving. And soon, there is nothing left but poverty, despair, rage, and hate. That is what former Prime Minister Gordon Brown has warned is happening. Britain’s becoming a failed state. He is not wrong. He is right. In the deadliest way of all. Brits are failing their democracy their democracy is not failing them. They are willing their own society to self-destruction. Americans, came to their senses, voted, finally, for Joe Biden and against rampant neoliberalism. But Brits are not coming to their senses. They seem to have had the sense beaten out of them. The conservatives were in power for over a decade and were useless. Boris, Truss, Rishi were crooks or deluded. And now what will Britain be if Reform gains any influence? To infect mainstream politics and the electorate like a malignant disease with homophobic, racist, nativist, fascist, sexist, antisemitic and Islamophobic ideas. A morally bankrupt, sordid, poor little forgotten island, of fools, drunk on beer, egotism, jingoism, shouting at the world, wave flagging barbarians shaking their fists in desperate, stupid, ugly impotent rage. “We’re number one!! You fools!! Bow!!” And the world, being the world, will laugh pityingly, and move swiftly on".

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  • [–] 9 points 2 days ago

    I fucking hate the flag-shagging.

    Some folks tried that in Edinburgh, and they were taken down in a few days. Then put up again. Then taken down again.
    Cheap polyester madie-in-china tat cable tied to lampposts.
    It's not patriotic, it's insipid and cliche.

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  • [–] -4 points 2 days ago (4 children)

    Ideally we should have flags and improve people's lives imho

    Flags on lampposts is a common thing where I live. They've specially adapted the lampposts to accommodate them in some places, to make it look nice and tidy. Works well.

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  • [–] 4 points 2 days ago (3 children)
  • [–] -3 points 2 days ago (2 children)
  • [–] 2 points 2 days ago (1 child)

    Well the only place in the UK I saw that stuff was in the bit of Ireland we havent given back yet. There, either community flies masses of flags on the approaches to their villages and towns as a display of cultural intimidation. This is not the sort of behaviour we should seek to import.

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  • [–] -1 points 1 day ago

    In most cases it's not cultural intimidation, it's pride and celebration. There are cases of paramilitaries using it to mark their territory, but in those cases it's specific paramilitary flags, not national flags.

    Also it's not "haven't given back yet" Given "back" to whom exactly? Dublin? The Republic of Ireland was never sovereign over Northern Ireland. Northern Ireland is in fact older than the Irish Free State / Republic of Ireland. Northern Ireland belongs to the people of Northern Ireland. That was exercised in 1912, 1922, 1973 and 1998. On these occasions, Northern Ireland specifically moved to remain a part of the UK. Since 1998, it's been a constitutional matter that the UK has to remain sovereign over Northern Ireland unless the majority of it's voter base votes to leave. With a majority in the elected assembly being against leaving, that's not going to happen anytime soon.

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  • [+] -13 points 2 days ago (23 children)
  • [–] 10 points 2 days ago (18 children)

    It's the fact that the only groups mobilising people to put flags on lampposts are the far-right ones. For migrant or LGBT folks living there, the flags are a constant reminder that people who hate them are close by and organised.

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  • [–] -3 points 2 days ago (17 children)

    That's why everyone should use the national flag. It'll take it back. A good example is the Labour Party beginning to prominently use it.

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  • [–] 9 points 2 days ago (16 children)

    Not everyone wants to shag the flag though. It would be nice to get on with our lives without it being shoved in our faces. People shouldnt be compelled to be patriotic

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  • [+] -6 points 2 days ago (15 children)

    The term "flag shagger" is so uniquely British because for whatever reason we are one of the few countries in the world that seems to hate ourselves. They felt the need to neuter the coronation to cater to the whining of people who weren't even going to watch it in the first place. So it creates a reactionary response.

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  • [–] 3 points 2 days ago (3 children)

    The people doing this use the flag intentionally because it makes it almost impossible to complain about it. They've highjacked the flag and warped what it stands for.

    There is also an element of 90's football hooliganism. Before this recent right-wing stunt, when I see a st Georges flag raised my first thought is the person raising it is a football idiot.

    So I don't think it's people hating their country or the flags specifically, it's more about disliking the morons who use it and what they think it stands for.

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  • [–] -1 points 1 day ago (2 children)

    Then unwarp it. Our forefathers fought and many died for what that flag truly represents.

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  • [–] 3 points 2 days ago (10 children)

    Nations are dumb and I don't care about the monarch or have any strong feelings, positive or negative, toward the flag. Sue me.

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  • [–] -1 points 2 days ago (9 children)

    So there's no problem with there being crowns and jacks everywhere then? Especially if put up with good intentions

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  • [–] 4 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (8 children)

    No, because that's people forcing their dumbass fanclub into public spaces. I'd take issue the same way with people putting football flags everywhere

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  • [–] -4 points 2 days ago (7 children)

    The public space is in that fanclub though, the fanclub being the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Should all public spaces just be bland concrete squares to just not force any kind of heritage on anybody?

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  • [–] 5 points 2 days ago* (6 children)

    I resent that. If you're into flags and kings or whatever that's your business, I don't see why I should be inundated with it in the places I go to shop and work.

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  • [–] -3 points 2 days ago (5 children)

    Because you live and work in the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. It is a Kingdom with a King and the flag is the Union Flag. If you are a citizen, you are a subject of His Majesty The King.

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  • [–] 4 points 2 days ago (4 children)

    His majesty the king can go get a real job and stop living off of my taxes as far as I'm concerned

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  • [–] -4 points 2 days ago (3 children)

    They're not your taxes, they're his taxes.

    Also he mainly lives off of a portion of the income from his own estate, which most of which goes back into the treasury anyway

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  • [–] 5 points 2 days ago (2 children)

    They're not your taxes, they're his taxes.

    Right yeah which he's earned from the critical service of sitting on his pampered arse signing things

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  • [–] 14 points 2 days ago (1 child)

    What about the Nazi flag? Could easily cause alarm and distress. Just because you don't perceive something as likely to cause distress, doesn't mean that someone else does if fact get distressed by it.

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  • [–] -3 points 2 days ago

    The difference is, the Union Flag and St George's Cross represent the they're placed in. The Nazi flag represents Nazi Germany. The problem is that mainly right wingers are using the national flag. I think everyone should be using it.

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