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Praxis (lemmygrad.ml)
submitted 1 month ago by to c/memes@lemmygrad.ml
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Sauce: https://www.reddit.com/r/TankieTheDeprogram/comments/1wajmco/thank_you_for_your_service_comrade/

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[–] 21 points 1 month ago (16 children)

Popular sentiment in canada is that international students abuse their visas to seek citizenship (no, I don't get it either), but universities are suffering due to limits on international enrollment, as they pay higher tuition.

Comrade really did please everyone, and added in fucking with banks as a bonus ✨

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  • [–] [S] 11 points 1 month ago (11 children)

    That Canadian belief is so bull. Canada arguably doesn't have enough people. If they want to move beyond being a US resource colony, they need way more of their own engineers and stuff, which immigrants can be.

    Western universities are also all reliant on foreign student tuition to pad their budgets (short on state funding because of neoliberalism), so complaining about that is just stupid.

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  • [–] 13 points 1 month ago (9 children)

    The people complaining about immigration are not the people complaining about underfunding schools.

    And canada has a lot of engineers, both domestically trained and those who immigrated, but the capitalists are addicted to underpaying extremely qualified immigrants who do not yet have their credentials validated. Why would you pay a graduate when you could get a mid level for the same price?

    Engineering school is like medical school before the residency, except our "residency" isn't as closely watched by the regulating body so companies have no real obligation to provide useful training or mentorship. Without those vital entry level positions they can't get a licence and can't work as engineers.

    Just to be clear I am only saying this to push back on the idea that canada doesn't graduate engineers or there are less or something. I'm an extremely frustrated mid career engineer 😅 I have no comment on immigration policy because borders are bullshit.

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  • [–] 10 points 1 month ago (4 children)

    In a similar vein, most all of the trades graduates aren't able to find viable apprenticeships. I know several electrician graduates who can't find any apprenticeships even within their own province, let alone their city.

    Nobody will hire and train a "newbie". And the older generations are well aware and critical of this as well.

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  • [–] 9 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    As a Canadian apprenticing in Germany, the more I learn about trades in Canada the happier I am doing it here. Y'all have to buy your own tools!? Take unpaid leave from work to go to school?! Things are chaotic and frustrating in Germany as well, but at least it's a fully organized and coherent system.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

    Yes, I know this pain too as I work on construction projects and my brother is a tradesperson.

    I've had to stop work way too often as a result of people doing dangerous things because they don't know better. Not like questionable but low risk short cuts when the safety rep isn't around. I always try and explain why I stopped something and more often than not they stop whining once they realize they had no idea what they were risking.

    We do a lot of mentoring on our personal time, or work later to catch up because we are trying to bring the juniors along with us as much as possible. Same thing for helping people with international training get their licences so they can practice fully and not be exploited with shitty (insecure/low paying) contracts. It's a lot.

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  • [–] 3 points 1 month ago

    Not only are the trades here no longer the golden ticket they were cracked up to be, that goes for basically every fucking job lol. If you aren’t a time traveller who somehow has 5+ years of experience despite just getting into whatever field we’re talking about, you can basically just kys or move to an impossibly expensive city (good luck without that job).
    If I could trade my credentials back for a refund I would do it in a heartbeat.

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  • [–] 6 points 1 month ago (3 children)

    God I wish Engineering degrees forced you to have residency. At least then I'd be able to be guaranteed work and experience.

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  • [–] 7 points 1 month ago* (2 children)

    I'm probably taking this too literally but they kinda do, in canada at least. You can't get a licence without meeting the experience requirements. When I did mine it was 4 years. It's reduced now with more of a focus demonstrating competencies. And just like residency, a placement isn't guaranteed. I think it's slightly less sadistic and exploitative than a medical residency tho.

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  • [–] 8 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    Here in the US, we have licenses that are based on programs and different classes. You got to pass a test (difficult ones at that) to get a license in those programs or to work as different kinds of engineers, but you're not given any employment. If you wanna get an entry level position, you better hope you got accepted for an internship while you were a student because no one will hire you.

    For my major, we have the bonus of needing a license to operate a nuclear reactor BUT the class to get that license is limited capacity and you aren't forced to take it, and it's in fact competitive. We are all required to take a class to learn how to operate the reactor but not one that gives us a license.

    You can imagine the frustration.

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  • [–] 5 points 1 month ago

    Just adding more details to compare and contrast:

    • the experience requirement isn't the only requirement, you have to go to accredited schools or write technical exams, and there is a law and ethics exam.
    • having an engineering licence is a min requirement for many jobs, not a foot in the door
    • I have separate licencing for my professional area (also operating) that was done entirely outside of school. You either need years of separate operating hours for that one too, or a combo of other things including a much higher passing grade on the four exams which are 3 hours each. I did that within 5 years of graduation and there is no way in hell I could have done that if I didn't have the flexibility of an entry level job. I could do shifts with operators to learn. Now I'm supposed to require my more senior staff to get them? Nah. I'll help them as much as I can, but I'm not holding them to that impossible requirement.
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  • [–] 4 points 1 month ago (3 children)

    Also places like BC with the foreign real estate buyer tax have really done international students dirty.

    I'll let you all ponder that one.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 month ago (2 children)

    Aren't international students who are able to buy property just very wealthy and not really there to study (hard sciences)? Maybe I've just fallen for propaganda but I don't feel particularly bad for the majority of international students who can, and do buy property. Assuming that the international students who can buy property are more or less already set for life. And that few domestic students can by property either.

    I don't support the tax its discriminatory of course. But realistically "real" international students arent buying property anyways.

    Again, I fear I've fallen for reactionary bait, if so my apologies.

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  • [–] 2 points 1 month ago (1 child)

    Aren’t international students who are able to buy property just very wealthy and not really there to study (hard sciences)?

    Of course. Or at least their parents are. Doesn't mean there aren't sob stories in the media about students who have to break off their studies because now their parents can't afford to buy them an apartment.

    few domestic students can by property either.

    Just an anecdote from personal experience: the road to the main university in Vancouver runs through a large provincial park, and this road is lined with camping vehicles where students live. Some even live in Calgary (600km straight-line distance and not a cheap place to live either) and fly to mandatory lectures once or twice a week in order to make life affordable.

    I don’t support the tax its discriminatory of course.

    I'm not sure it is discriminatory in a negative sense. Maybe this is worth a post on its own. The point of the foreign buyers tax was to slightly cool the real estate price inflation craziness of the mid 2010s. A foreign citizen yet current resident of the region is exempt. The idea was to make speculation and offshore investment less attractive. But you can't go too far on cooling price inflation because the retirement accounts of Canadians rely on real estate inflation - either directly via owning one's own home, or indirectly as a part of a pension investment program. I would argue it doesn't go far enough, but again Canada is dependent on this and it's a liberal country built on private property.

    Personally, I don't think it's discriminatory to tell a resident of Europe/Asia/wherever that they are not allowed to own a home in Canada without living there. There are people who need those homes more.

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