190
Super Smash Bros Ultimate now runs natively on PC at 60 FPS, no emulator required (www.tweaktown.com)
submitted 3 days ago by to c/pcgaming@lemmy.ca
62 comments fedilink hide all child comments
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] 25 points 3 days ago (12 children)

It won’t be soon, if ever. It takes multiple years for these kinds of projects, even on a purely PC based game. As shit as it is, these kinds of recomplations are going to be extremely slow, or AI assisted/generated. There isn’t really a middle ground.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 12 child comments
    •
  • [–] 4 points 2 days ago (2 children)

    I think only question is if the people utilizing the AI code know what the code is doing and are reviewing it instead of not knowing what it does.

    That's the concern with it looking like a potentially great malware vector as things move forward if people are trusting more and more things to AI generated code and not doing thorough review processes.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 3 points 2 days ago* (1 child)

    That's the concern with it looking like a potentially great malware vector as things move forward if people are trusting more and more things to AI generated code and not doing thorough review processes.

    Kind of a sci-fi thought... what happens if AI uses AI slop code as a vector to insert subtle bits of code in multiple projects that seem innocuous on their own but are actually creating a distributed AI hive mind.

    I'm not saying I think that's what's happening right now or that it's possible any time soon, but we've seen malware inserted in apps, bitcoin mining on iPhone apps, etc. Skynet Super Claude being created without us noticing isn't maybe the craziest thing? Someone else said this project is 57k lines of code; aint nobody got time to check all that.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
    •
  • [–] 3 points 2 days ago

    In a decompilation thread I saw someone asking about potential viruses for projects uploaded from new accounts that are currently popping out all the time. someone said just ask AI to check.

    Which is kind of the direction we are headed if it's come down to ask AI to check for malware, hope AI is more competent than the AI being used to decompile things, and in the end nobody knows what is going on and have to just trust the AI is thorough and no errors or oversights are made.

    Nobody really knows what is going on anymore. Not even the people who submitted the project to be made.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 1 point 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (7 children)

    Static recompilations don't take nearly as long as full on decompilations and subsequent PC ports (assuming no AI is used for either).

    For example, rpcs3 already uses static recompilation for much of its emulation already (in addition to more traditional emulation), and that runs a large chunk of the PS3's library.

    The difficult part with static recompilation is to create the tool for the job, like ReXGlue for Xbox 360, N64Recomp, etc.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 7 child comments
    •
  • [–] 8 points 3 days ago (6 children)

    You do realize rpcs3 has been in the works for 15 years. I'm glad rpcs3 doesn't use AI (in fact its jump from 70% to 80% playability tgis year was without AI) but you're lying to yourself if you are saying it doesn't take long my guy.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 6 child comments
    •
  • [–] 1 point 3 days ago* (5 children)

    rpcs3 was just one example. N64Recomp and ReXGlue are more recent examples of tools that didn't take anywhere near as long to develop.

    Also, I'm referring more to the individual games rather than the tooling when I'm talking about recomps.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 5 child comments
    •
  • [–] 2 points 2 days ago (4 children)

    N64 recomp is a good example, but I would argue that the n64 is quite a few steps below the "modern" consoles of the 2000's. As for RexGlue it relies on Xenia which started in 2013 and took 5 years to get 3D.

    I can build a house in a day given a front door and a finished house missing a front door.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
    •
  • [–] 1 point 2 days ago

    N64 has historically been one of the more complicated consoles to emulate. Being old is no indicator for complexity. The latest xbox for example internally is much more like a generic pc than the PS3 was (also a complex one to emulate).

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • [–] 2 points 2 days ago (2 children)

    N64 emulation has been notoriously difficult to perfect and has historically relied on per-game hacks. Only recently with projects like ares and FPGA cores has emulation gotten much better. Try running any libdragon software on any older N64 emulator to see what I mean. Also N64Recomp specifically is worth mentioning because it is the first notable static recomp tool for video games that I can think of, being used with Zelda64Recomp first.

    There's also XenonRecomp that came before, not based on Xenia (AFAIK), Suyu's recent Switch recompilation tool, PS2Recomp, DolRecomp (for GCN and Wii), nWiiURecomp, and probably way more that I'm missing.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 2 child comments
    •
  • [–] 1 point 1 day ago (1 child)

    You can keep naming static recompilers but there is still years of emulation research behind each one. I could keep going through them and pointing out the fact that most of them say "inspired by X" in their respective readme's but we would be here forever. But just to name a couple more: XenonRecomp - relied on Xenia as a reference (check special thanks) N64Recomp - went ahead and looked at the readme for this and he mentions IDO static recompilation project as inspiration for it (not sure if anything was actually used) Suyu - obviously built using the existing knowledge gained from the emulator (and in the end still falls back to emulation) PS2Recomp - references pcsx2, also still in very early stages. Its hard to tell how many games have been recomped with it but Playported only shows 10 playable Recomp/Decomps

    My point is, kairuByte is right, these projects are measured in years. We don't see it because we are standing on the shoulders of giants.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 1 child comment
    •
  • [–] 1 point 1 day ago*

    And AI stands on the shoulders on human labor.

    Obviously these static recompilation tools (and I purposefully picked ones where I saw no obvious help from LLMs, though I didn't look too carefully) had massive help from prior emulation projects, but they were/are still novel projects (maybe barring Suyu).

    Also, it's very possible that N64Recomp used direct ideas or even code from IDO Static Recomp, since that's a project that recompiles IRIX programs, and there is a direct link there given the SGI lineage of both hardware architectures.

    The main point I was trying to make is that AI doesn't need to be used to attain speed when it comes to porting games now that these ideas and tooling exist, as these tools can now be used, or new ones creates for consoles that don't yet have them.

  • permalink
  • fedilink
  • source
  • parent