Hello. I am looking for an alternative to Telegram and I prefer an application that uses decentralised servers. My question is: why is the xmpp+omemo protocol not recommended on websites when it is open source and decentralised? The privacyguides.org website does not list xmpp+omemo as a recommended messaging service. Nor does this website include it in its comparison of private messaging services.

https://www.privacyguides.org/en/assets/img/cover/real-time-communication.webp

Why do you think xmpp and its messaging clients such as Conversations, Movim, Gajim, etc. do not appear in these guides?

top 50 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] 25 points 8 months ago (11 children)

Here is a blog post by a widely respected cryptographer on why XMPP+OMEMO is not secure: https://soatok.blog/2024/08/04/against-xmppomemo/

  • source
  • hideshow 11 child comments
  • load more comments (6 replies)
    [–] 14 points 8 months ago

    Misleading title.

  • source
  • [–] 13 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (1 child)

    I've personally used 4 encrypted communication apps, here are my thoughts:

    Signal: huge downside that it required a phone number (not sure if it still does), and the centralized nature of it makes me very wary of it. It worked reliably when I did use it, but I no longer use it.

    Matrix with Element: As others mentioned, it leaks meta data. It wasn't very reliable in my experience with encrypted group chats. Messages would constantly not be readable by other users in the chat, requiring frequent re-sending to finally get through. Overall I found it very frustrating to use.

    XMPP: Experience can somewhat vary depending on the app used. With the Movim desktop front-end, I can sometimes have issues with encrypted messages not getting unencrypted (possibly just user error on my part), but with mobile apps like Conversations or Monocles, its been pretty much 100% reliable. Doesn't drain my battery either. Would recommend.

    Deltachat: I've used this the least, but I really like it. Super easy to connect to friends and join a group chat, its all encrypted by default so no real chance of encountering an unencrypted message, very nice UI, is available on all platforms as one app, and has been 100% reliable with low battery drain. Highly recommend if you don't need to make voice calls (it can do texts, images, and supports voice/video files you can send and play within the app).

  • source
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • load more comments (1 reply)
    [+] 10 points 8 months ago (5 children)
  • [–] 9 points 8 months ago (16 children)

    Self host your matrix server, use Continuwuity not Synapse, and do not enable federation.

  • source
  • hideshow 16 child comments
  • load more comments (3 replies)
    [–] 8 points 8 months ago (1 child)

    I know it's not the most popular, but I've genuinely been happy with Matrix for the last few years. Obviously there are problems, but it really has gotten fairly stable. At least...for me...

  • source
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • [+] 7 points 8 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (3 children)
  • load more comments (2 replies)
    [–] 7 points 8 months ago (1 child)

    The freenet/futo devs are working something called river (https://freenet.org/). I don't think it's mobile yet and cannot attest to it's call quality. It's fully decentralized though, so it should work even if they abandon the project. Here's a video on the protocol https://youtu.be/3SxNBz1VTE0 Mostly goes over the introductory docs that're on the site.

  • source
  • hideshow 1 child comment
  • load more comments (1 reply)
    [–] 6 points 8 months ago

    I've hardly used it so far, but simpleX seems promising from my limited knowledge. I highly suggest checking it out.

  • source
  • [–] 4 points 8 months ago

    No idea. I use the app Conversations (XMPP+Omemo) and it works great. Only downside ist that you have to somewhat trust the server you are on, because of metadata. But thats basically every chat app.

  • source
  • [–] 4 points 8 months ago

    Prosody XMPP + Pidgin/(Monal|Xabber) has always worked for me. It is not hard to setup or manage, has E2E encryption too.

  • source
  • [–] 3 points 8 months ago

    Right now, the open source community has so many different ways to communicate.

    The problem is what is the goal, privacy or security.

    All seem to have benefits and problems.

    I use conversations and delta chat. I don't know what is best. But it is better that anything that is owned by big corps.

  • source
  • [–] 3 points 8 months ago* (3 children)

    Tox, where is TOX ? Why it's not mentioned in the article ? It's te most private messaging app, no other app can be more secure.

  • source
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • load more comments (3 replies)
    [–] 2 points 8 months ago (6 children)

    You should check out "keet" or "Jami" for privacy message app.

  • source
  • hideshow 6 child comments
  • [–] 6 points 8 months ago (5 children)

    Jami is nice in theory, but it was very buggy for me when I tried it and Jami calls had no noise cancelling at all. Other than that, it does work.

    I cant find the "keet" git repo, I think its proprietary. So thats a no go for privacy.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 5 child comments
  • [–] 2 points 8 months ago (4 children)

    https://github.com/holepunchto/keet-appling-next

    Here is the github link, note that, this is the "shell" of the desktop. There is another repo specifically for android app.

    https://keet.io/ is the official website

    Developer is holepunch and uses "pear" peer-to-peer protocol.

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 4 child comments
  • [–] 3 points 8 months ago (3 children)

    Yeah, I saw that too, that not the full source code. I found another repository for the android releases: https://github.com/holepunchto/keet-mobile-releases

    Again, no source code, just binaries. Rather shady I think...

  • source
  • parent
  • hideshow 3 child comments
  • load more comments (1 reply)
  • load more comments
    view more: next ›